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+--- Tema: Plantillas europeas (/showthread.php?tid=7672)
RE: Plantillas europeas - mega60 - 08-04-2022
Rangers 1963/64 https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/t/t1963-6410016.html
David Provan, 11/03/1931, Falkirk (Escocia), fallece el 26/11/2016, también temporada 1964/65, foto https://beyondthelastman.files.wordpress.com/2013/12/dave-provan-rangers-1963.jpg
Ronnie McKinnon: Ronald McKinnon, 20/08/1940, Glasgow (Escocia), también temporada 1964/65, foto https://live.staticflickr.com/7083/7330056320_c44b34c94f_b.jpg
Jim Forrest: James Forrest, 22/09/1944, Glasgow (Escocia), también temporada 1964/65, Aberdeen temporadas 1971/72 y 1972/73, fotos https://alchetron.com/cdn/jim-forrest-footballer-born-1944-83a71701-fa22-4fec-b518-59580766481-resize-750.jpeg | https://i.pinimg.com/originals/8f/c8/36/8fc8369d0180e2d87ef0a125cda9abf7.jpg
George McLean: George Tomlinson McLean, 26/05/1943, Paisley (Escocia), también temporada 1964/65, foto https://i.pinimg.com/736x/ba/22/5e/ba225e09aa2fe484ee3087e464a53ca9.jpg
Alexander Willoughby, 17/09/1944, Springburn (Escocia), delantero, fallece el 14/07/2004, también Aberdeen temporadas 1971/72, 1972/73 y 1973/74, fotos https://www.pglglasgow.org.uk/images/alex-willoughby1.jpg | https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-BXYz0er5GqU/WxUs_CSS9SI/AAAAAAACMw0/L-Bqe4hvfwsGzVV29tKKjYJcDSXP7lz5gCLcBGAs/s1600/73-74%2BAandBC%2B-%2BFootballers%2B-%2BScottish%2B-146.jpg
RE: Plantillas europeas - xellos - 08-04-2022
FC Luzern
1986-87
Mohr
1989-90
Friedel Rausch
1990-91
van Eck
Knup
1997-98
Kögl
2010-11
Rolf Fringer
Gygax
Hakan Yakin
Zverotić
Veškovac
Paiva
2012-13
Rangelov
Lezcano
Hyka
2014-15
Affolter
Freuler
Doubaï
2016-17
Markus Babbel
Ricardo Costa
Haas
Neumayr
Itten
Juric
Omlin
2017-18
Francisco Rodríguez
Ugrinic
Vargas
Feka
2018-19
Lucas Alves
Schulz
2019-20
Müller
Kakabadze
Ndenge
RE: Plantillas europeas - mega60 - 09-04-2022
Rangers 1964/65 https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/t/t1964-6510016.html
Wilson Wood, 25/01/1943, Whitburn (Escocia), fallece el 13/06/2017, fotos http://www.londonhearts.com/images/ianc/images/Wilson_Wood.jpg | http://cards.littleoak.com.au/197273_abc_orange_red_scottish/098%20Wilson%20Wood.jpg
Willie Johnston: William McClure Johnston, 19/12/1946, Maryhill (Escocia), 170 cm, también Heart of Midlothian temporada 1984/85, fotos https://i.pinimg.com/originals/8e/c4/29/8ec429796aa235c928a0ba42e3818023.jpg | https://www.tcdb.com/Images/Cards/Soccer/171043/171043-10978441RepFr.jpg
Roger Hynd: John Roger Shankly Hynd, 02/02/1942, Falkirk (Escocia), fallece el 18/02/2017, foto https://i2-prod.birminghammail.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/article12627578.ece/ALTERNATES/s1200/WA2990872.jpg
RE: Plantillas europeas - mega60 - 09-04-2022
Rangers 2011/12 https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/t/t2011-1210016.html
Ally McCoist: Alistair Murdoch McCoist, 24/09/1962, Bellshill (Escocia), 178 cm, delantero, como futbolista Rangers 1984/85 | 1985/86 | 1986/87 | 1987/88 | 1988/89 | 1990/91 | 1991/92 | 1992/93 | 1993/94 | 1994/95 | 1995/96 | 1996/97 | 1997/98, Kilmarnock 1999/2000, fotos futbolista https://i.pinimg.com/originals/db/8b/d8/db8bd899f1badac965ac42f525dfb0a5.png | https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2018/03/nintchdbpict000371188289.jpg foto entrenador https://i.guim.co.uk/img/static/sys-images/Football/Pix/pictures/2011/7/26/1311696108957/Ally-McCoist-the-Rangers--007.jpg?width=465&quality=45&auto=format&fit=max&dpr=2&s=1d6df3cb1321478db1c4e4806cbf2c18
Saša Papac, 07/02/1980, Mostar (Bosnia), 185 cm, lateral izquierdo, también Rangers 2007/08 | 2008/09 | 2009/10 | 2010/11, Kärnten 2001/02 | 2002/03 | 2003/04, Austria Wien 2004/05 | 2005/06 | 2006/07, fotos https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/sasa-papac-11102011-france-bosnie-eliminatoire-pour-euro-2012-photo-picture-id644569486?s=612x612 | https://cloud10.todocoleccion.online/cromos-futbol/tc/2017/03/25/12/81067184.jpg | https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/sasa-papac-rangers-picture-id809025144?s=612x612
Lee McCulloch https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/j/j94765.html nace en Bellshill (Escocia), 185 cm, centrocampista, también Motherwell 1995/96, foto https://www.heartsfc.co.uk/uploads/images/player_small/1603183238jighead.jpg
Whittaker https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/j/j95731.html también Hibernian 2005/06 | 2018/19, fotos https://www4.pictures.zimbio.com/gi/Glasgow+Rangers+v+Kilmarnock+Zxdx5Z3Ow00x.jpg | https://www.scotsman.com/images-e.jpimedia.uk/imagefetch/http://www.scotsman.com/webimage/Prestige.Item.1.57479451!image/image.jpg?width=2048&enable=upscale | https://dafc.co.uk/files/CBPA5717_9119.jpg
Maurice Edu Jr. https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/j/j95727.html le sobra Jr., foto https://factsbuddy.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/02/Maurice-Edu.jpg
Jelavić https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/j/j95627.html foto https://imgresizer.eurosport.com/unsafe/1200x0/filters:format(jpeg)/origin-imgresizer.eurosport.com/2011/08/30/754135-21065623-2560-1440.jpg
Naismith https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/j/j95650.html fotos https://resources.premierleague.com/premierleague/photos/players/250x250/p18981.png | https://www.thesun.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2017/05/nintchdbpict000318493156.jpg
RE: Plantillas europeas - mega60 - 10-04-2022
Rangers 2011/12 https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/t/t2011-1210016.html
Alexander https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/j/j90922.html James Neil Alexander, foto https://livingstonfc.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/1.-Neil-Alexander-72.jpg
Kane Hemmings: Kane Ruudi Hemmings, 08/04/1992, Burton upon Trent (Inglaterra), 186 cm, delantero, también Rangers 2010/11, foto https://d1ssu070pg2v9i.cloudfront.net/pex/dfc/2019/08/08100624/08-08-2019_-Kane-Hemmings-_dy_0113.jpg
Fleck https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/j/j25599.html John Alexander Fleck, fotos https://cdn.theathletic.com/app/uploads/2020/01/22064117/GettyImages-805343768-e1579693319898.jpg | https://i2.wp.com/www.solvecollectibles.com/wp-content/uploads/2021/11/482-John-Fleck-Sticker-Sheffield-United-Premier-League-2021-Football-Sticker-scaled.jpg?fit=1920%2C2560&ssl=1
Salim Kerkar, 04/08/1987, Givors (Francia), 183 cm, centrocampista, también nacionalidad argelina, foto https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/salim-kerkar-rangers-picture-id846990250?s=612x612 hermano de Karim Kerkar https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/j/j87540.html nacionalidad principal la argelina (internacional)
Kirk Broadfoot: Kirk John Broadfoot, 08/08/1984, Irvine (Escocia), 191 cm, defensa, también Rangers 2007/08 | 2008/09 | 2010/11 y Kilmarnock 2019/20, fotos https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2017/05/nintchdbpict000004947039.jpg | https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/kilmarnock-fcs-kirk-broadfoot-picture-id1227836406
Healy https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/j/j95008.html foto https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/glasgowrangers-striker-david-healy-limbers-up-at-training-picture-id1298493814?s=2048x2048
Gregg Wylde, 23/03/1991, Kirkintilloch (Escocia), 178 cm, centrocampista, también Rangers 2010/11, foto https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/gregg-wylde-rangers-picture-id809692860?s=2048x2048
Thomas Bendiksen: Thomas Kind Bendiksen, 08/08/1989, Harstad (Noruega), 183 cm, centrocampista, también Tromsø 2012/13 | 2013/14 | 2014/15 y Molde 2015/16, fotos https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/thomas-bendiksen-of-sandefjord-fotball-during-photocall-on-march-15-picture-id653629114?s=612x612 | https://statistikk.til.no/sites/default/files/_an59791.jpg
Goian https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/j/j97501.html defensa central, también Asteras 2015/16, fotos https://alchetron.com/cdn/dorin-goian-956d0a61-a3dc-409a-aa89-9306b424f13-resize-750.jpeg | https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/gross/36304.jpg
Lafferty https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/j/j25011.html foto https://cdn.planetradio.co.uk/one/media/5bc7/3ca5/f0f0/d358/3171/dd80/celticrangers111.JPG?quality=80&format=jpg&width=960&ratio=16-9&crop=30,0,1095,1894&resize=crop
Jordan McMillan, 16/10/1988, Glasgow (Escocia), 178 cm, lateral derecho, también Rangers 2006/07 | 2010/11, foto https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/v-rangers-solar-technics-arena-lottejordan-mcmillan-in-action-for-picture-id1298290945?s=2048x2048
Ross Perry. 07/02/1990, Falkirk (Escocia), 188 cm, defensa central, también Rangers 2006/07 | 2010/11, foto https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/ross-perry-of-rangers-in-training-picture-id1287840919?s=594x594
Weir https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/j/j93696.html también Heart of Midlothian 1996/97 (Weir) | 1998/99 (Weir), fotos https://www.mediastorehouse.com/p/767/heart-midlothian-footballer-david-weir-21614558.jpg.webp | https://www.scottishfa.co.uk/media/2971/david-weir.jpg?mode=crop&width=500&height=638&anchor=top
Kyle Hutton, 05/02/1991, Cambuslang (Escocia), 189 cm, centrocampista, también Rangers 2010/11, foto https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/cumbernauldkyle-hutton-in-action-for-rangers-picture-id1298463470?s=2048x2048
RE: Plantillas europeas - mega60 - 10-04-2022
Rangers 1972/73 https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/t/t1972-7310016.html
Jock Wallace https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/l/l7348.html también entrenador Rangers 1975/76 (y no Wiliam Waddell) | 1976/77 | 1984/85 | 1985/86, fotos https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2018/06/NINTCHDBPICT000004736259.jpg | https://a.espncdn.com/photo/2016/0427/r78043_1296x729_16-9.jpg
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Willie_Waddell | https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jock_Wallace_Jr.
McCloy: Peter McCloy, 26/11/1946, Girvan (Escocia), también Rangers 1975/76 | 1976/77 | 1978/79 | 1984/85 y Heart of Midlothian 1988/89, fotos https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/8997489115_e403303e7c_b.jpg | https://footballinprint.com/wp-content/uploads/peter-mccloy-rangers-754x1000.png
Mathieson: Willie Mathieson, 20/07/1943, Cardenden (Escocia), lateral izquierdo, foto https://i.pinimg.com/736x/2e/6a/ca/2e6acabe02bf03aa7d0efd4e0eca9fba.jpg
Jardine: William Pullar Jardine, 31/12/1948, Edinburgh (Escocia), lateral derecho, fallece el 24/04/2014, también Rangers 1975/76 | 1976/77 | 1978/79 y Heart of Midlothian 1984/85 | 1986/87 (todas las temporadas Sandy Jardine), fotos https://www.scotsman.com/images-e.jpimedia.uk/imagefetch/http://www.scotsman.com/webimage/Prestige.Item.1.33562050!image/3365038959.jpg?width=640&enable=upscale | https://s.hs-data.com/bilder/spieler/gross/28742.jpg | https://i.pinimg.com/originals/d4/79/ec/d479ec4194c45575285578cbae3aa8e2.jpg
Forsyth: Thomas Forsyth, 23/01/1949, Glasgow (Escocia), 183 cm, defensa central, fallece el 14/08/2020, también Rangers 1975/76 | 1976/77 | 1978/79, foto https://i2-prod.dailyrecord.co.uk/incoming/article22524618.ece/ALTERNATES/s1200c/0_921664.jpg
Young: Quintin Young, 19/09/1947, Irvine (Escocia), también Rangers 1975/76, foto https://i.pinimg.com/originals/a2/57/e1/a257e18fc65cc882986369d5043937a2.jpg
Smith: David Bruce Smith, 14/11/1943, Aberdeen (Escocia), foto https://live.staticflickr.com/3818/13663192055_bfdbd698e5_b.jpg
MacDonald: Alexander MacDonald, 17/03/1948, Glasgow (Escocia), también Rangers 1975/76 | 1976/77 | 1978/79 y Heart of Midlothian 1984/85, también entrenador Heart of Midlothian 1984/85 | 1986/87 | 1988/89 y Airdrieonians 1992/93 (y no John Binnie), fotos futbolista https://imgresizer.eurosport.com/unsafe/1200x0/filters:format(jpeg)/origin-imgresizer.eurosport.com/2014/04/10/1215575-25370132-2560-1440.jpg | https://i.pinimg.com/originals/24/17/a2/2417a2440bd22a6c5b3c710c2b1fa903.jpg fotos entrenador https://www.londonhearts.com/images/man/images/Alex_MacDonald.jpg | https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/sport-football-pic-circa-1985-alex-macdonald-hearts-manager-picture-id79648714
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Airdrieonians_F.C._(1878)_managers
Parlane: Derek James Parlane, 05/05/1953, Helensburgh (Escocia), 183 cm, también Rangers 1975/76 | 1976/77 | 1978/79, foto https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/1774/9115/products/DEREK_20PARLANE_202_20-_20POSTER_20ONLY_800x.jpg?v=1554730273
Jonstone: Derek Joseph Johnstone, 04/11/1953, Dundee (Escocia), 183 cm, también Rangers 1975/76 | 1976/77 | 1978/79 | 1982/83 | 1985/86, fotos https://i.pinimg.com/236x/3c/3d/6f/3c3d6fe1eab7432f7769dca6d7f9f5f6.jpg | https://europeanrsa.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2020/01/ersa-derek-johnstone.jpg
McLean: Thomas McLean, 02/06/1947, Larkhall (Escocia), también Rangers 1975/76 | 1976/77 | 1978/79 y Kilmarnock 1965/66, entrenador Motherwell 1991/92 y Dundee United 1997/98, fotos como futbolista https://kilmarnockfc.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/10/Tommy-McLeanweb.jpg | https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Dq4q_8ZXQAAgX2e.jpg foto como entrenador https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2021/11/12f96a2a-3c01-4a92-bb0e-b7a83e7df78a-4.jpg
Conn: Alfred James Conn, 05/04/1952, Kirkcaldy (Escocia), también Celtic 1977/78, fotos https://alchetron.com/cdn/alfie-conn-jr-68a69438-ce9c-4279-9c09-51a722908a8-resize-750.jpeg | http://celticunderground.net/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/conn.jpg
Fyfe: Graham Fyfe, 18/08/1951, Motherwell (Escocia), también Rangers 1975/76, Hibernian 1976/77, fotos https://m.media-amazon.com/images/I/41l9yW3RJlL._AC_.jpg | https://alchetron.com/cdn/graham-fyfe-footballer-born-1951-860248a4-0fa8-44e3-ad43-8ba05e2b02a-resize-750.jpeg
RE: Plantillas europeas - mega60 - 10-04-2022
Rangers 2010/11 https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/t/t2010-1110016.html
Walter Smith https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/l/l93678.html Walter Ferguson Smith, defensa, como futbolista Dundee United 1977/78 | 1978/79, fotos futbolista https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/walter-smith-dundee-united-picture-id637431892?s=594x594 | https://www.scotsman.com/webimg/b25lY21zOjlhODBmNmQ2LTcwMDYtNDJmNy1hM2MwLThkMWY1YWY4NGE3ZTo0MWZmYjJlYi03OWE4LTQ1MDgtYjc4MS1lMTNhMTY1NDc0ODk=.jpg?width=640&enable=upscale
Miller https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/j/j94497.html fotos https://www.ceroacero.es/img/jogadores/98/330898_ori__20160418131223_kenny_miller.jpg | https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2019/10/NINTCHDBPICT000003525834.jpg
RE: Plantillas europeas - xellos - 10-04-2022
FC St. Gallen 1879
1983-84
Helmuth Johannsen
Gross
Veh
1985-86
Werner Olk
2013-14
Karanovic
Besle
Janjatovic
Lenjani
Martic
Keita
Wuthrich
2018-19
Stojanovic
Sierro
Quintillà
Ashimeru
Silvan Hefti
Tafer
Ben Khalifa
Kutesa
Itten
2020-21
Görtler
Youan
Watkowiak
Rüfli
FC Lausanne-Sport
1990-91
Verlaat
Ohrel
Hottiger
Iskrenov
Chapuisat
1991-92
La Placa
Comisetti
1998-99
Celestini
Ohrel
1999-00
Mazzoni
Kuźba
Magnin
2010-11
Basha
FC Sion
1973-74
Herrmann
1984-85
Bouderbala
1987-88
Pascolo
1989-90
Fournier
Mohr
1991-92
Calderón
Tudor
1992-93
Roberto de Assis
Lonfat
1994-95
Wicky
Karl
Marin
Kunz
Milton
1995-96
Kombouaré
Vercruysse
La Placa
Giallanza
1996-97
Albertino Bigon
Lukic
Vincze
Pancev
Najdoski
1997-98
Ouattara
Seoane
Grichting
Eydelie
Grassi
Camadini
Tholot
2006-07
Kali
Chedli
Gelson Fernandes
Bühler
Sarni
Carlitos
João Pinto
2007-08
Paíto
Alioui
Beto
2009-10
Didier Tholot
Marin
Serey Dié
Émile Mpenza
Yoda
Afonso
Sarni
2011-12
Adaílton
2017-18
Paulo Ricardo
Pinga
RE: Plantillas europeas - mega60 - 12-04-2022
Rangers 2010/11 https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/t/t2010-1110016.html
Darren Cole, 03/01/1992, Edinburgh (Escocia), 189 cm, defensa central, también Derry City 2018/19 (Cole) | 2020/21, fotos https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/v-rangers-bursa-ataturk-stadium-bursadarren-cole-in-action-for-picture-id1298484944?s=2048x2048 | https://b2e2h5t6.rocketcdn.me/soccer/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2021/03/darren-cole-derry-city-1985937-300x300.png
Beattie https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/j/j93676.html fotos https://www.saintsplayers.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/Beattie-ASA631.jpg | https://www.mediastorehouse.com.au/p/7/james-beattie-head-shot-325515.jpg.webp | https://editorial.uefa.com/resources/01e8-0e76019e0e1d-911e60a51eb1-1000/format/wide1/james_beattie_rangers_fc_.jpeg
Bartley https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/j/j95766.html fotos https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2018/05/nintchdbpict000005218065-e1526640791344.jpg | https://cdn.resfu.com/media/img_news/kyle-bartley--jugador-del-swansea-city--swanseafc.jpg?size=1000x&lossy=1 | https://resources.premierleague.com/premierleague/photos/players/250x250/p59940.png
Andrew Little, 12/05/1989, Enniskillen (Irlanda del Norte), 183 cm, delantero, también Rangers 2009/10, foto https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTb4QrjR1QfHy0wMC1QrVk9_OaeQxUI5WYARr2cBHzpToAf_YvUs6_7KDLo0D9_vBznUGM&usqp=CAU
Webster https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/j/j94940.html también Heart of Midlothian 2003/04 | 2004/05 | 2011/12 | 2012/13, fotos https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTJuyz8wa-0nMfV9z_DDSP9igwPLtSjfiSmkg&usqp=CAU | https://i2-prod.dailyrecord.co.uk/incoming/article1390884.ece/ALTERNATES/s615/Andy%20Webster
Rory Loy: Rory James Loy, 19/03/1988, Dumfries (Escocia), 178 cm, delantero, también Rangers 2009/10, foto https://encrypted-tbn0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcR7eBc0VlLZf4y6IokNpSxbz79iyp6Y4K_tSg&usqp=CAU
Diouf https://www.bdfutbol.com/es/j/j94317.html esta temporada primero el Blackburn Rovers, fotos https://imgresizer.eurosport.com/unsafe/1200x1200/smart/filters:format(jpeg)/origin-imgresizer.eurosport.com/2013/04/29/999430-19256984-2560-1440.jpg | https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2019/07/Untitled-design-49-3.png?crop=0px%2C0px%2C1800px%2C1201px&resize=1200%2C800
Richard Foster: Richard Martyn Foster, 31/07/1985, Elgin (Escocia), lateral derecho, también Aberdeen 2007/08 | 2009/10 y St Johnstone 2017/18, fotos https://media.gettyimages.com/photos/20062007aberdeenrichard-foster-picture-id1278059620?s=2048x2048 | https://cdn.planetradio.co.uk/one/radio-legacy/c7/061cb/1113d/ccfb5/8100c/25e3d/917cd/richardfoster.JPG?quality=80&format=jpg&width=960&ratio=16-9 | https://www.footballdatabase.eu/images/photos/players/2015-2016/a_23/23199.jpg
RE: Plantillas europeas - xellos - 21-04-2022
A modo de recordatorio, dejo por aquí algunas aportaciones mías de hace varios días:
https://www.bdfutbol.com/foro/showthread.php?tid=7672&pid=25262#pid25262
https://www.bdfutbol.com/foro/showthread.php?tid=7672&pid=25323#pid25323
https://www.bdfutbol.com/foro/showthread.php?tid=7672&pid=25332#pid25332
https://www.bdfutbol.com/foro/showthread.php?tid=7672&pid=25338#pid25338
https://www.bdfutbol.com/foro/showthread.php?tid=7672&pid=25388#pid25388
https://www.bdfutbol.com/foro/showthread.php?tid=7672&pid=25410#pid25410
https://www.bdfutbol.com/foro/showthread.php?tid=7672&pid=25425#pid25425
https://www.bdfutbol.com/foro/showthread.php?tid=7672&pid=25428#pid25428
https://www.bdfutbol.com/foro/showthread.php?tid=7672&pid=25431#pid25431
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